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My CB77 No Longer Charges the Battery

Charging System, Wiring, Lighting
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brewsky
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Location: Princeton, WV

Post by brewsky » Sat Jul 05, 2014 6:32 am

Sarah,

If I'm reading the electrical diagram right, when in lights off position, only 2 out of 6 total windings are being used, probably just enough to trickle charge the battery at rpm. (supplied by the yellow wire)

Anything more would cause the battery to eventually overcharge.

In lights on position, the pink wire adds the remaining 4 windings output to the yellow wire.
This should be designed to take care of the additional load from the lights.

Again, anything more than that would cause the battery to overcharge.

If you have hard wired the two (pink and yellow) together all the time, then you should always run with your lights on or you risk eventually overcharging.

I added a headlight cut off switch so I could run (temporarily) an additional load without discharging the battery by using all 6 coils with the headlight off.

But with the headlight off and all 6 engaged, I stopped reading the voltage at 14.7 and climbing, not wanting to blow my tail light bulb in the testing process. I don't know how high it would have gone if I continued to let it climb to max.

G,

"Crowd Sourcing" is definitely helpful in widening the view when looking for sources of the problem, and has saved me thousands in repair costs in the past!

To often we, (and that definitely includes me) try to fix something that's not broke.

I replaced a voltage regulator, and was getting ready to find a new stator when I finally discovered all 3 wires from the stator were corroded in two inside the wrap sheathing, and I had been riding who knows how long on the battery only. (on a different bike)
66 dream, 78 cb750k, 02fz1, 09 wing

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sarals
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Location: Monterey Peninsula, California

Post by sarals » Sat Jul 05, 2014 11:52 am

Brewsky, I took the jumper I made to tie the yellow and pink together out of the circuit. It's OEM, now.

I'm looking forward to getting off of the day shift at work so I can ride the Old Girl and see how she behaves.
1965 CB77 305 Super Hawk
1989 NT650 Hawk GT
1981 Yamaha XJ550 Seca

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sarals
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Location: Monterey Peninsula, California

Post by sarals » Sun Jul 06, 2014 11:46 am

I got a call from Bob Kizer yesterday about my Podtronics regulator/rectifier. I had sent it to him earlier in the week at his behest so he could examine it.

It works perfectly. Hmmm. We talked about the charging system on the bike, and he had some very insightful points to share. It seems our old Honda's electrical systems are very similar to the old Brit bikes, except for the number of coils they use in the stators. He also said, early on in our talk, that permanent magnets "are not really permanent". True enough. He suggested that it would be a good idea to have the rotor re-magnetized.

I told him about the tests I had done, and how I had done them, giving him voltages that I had found. He said the AC voltages were great. He asked me if I had measured the AC voltages at the input of the regulator/rectifier (with it in the circuit), and you know, I don't think I did. I took those measurements at the stator coil outputs with the coils disconnected from the wiring harness.

He was stumped when I told him that I had NO output from the regulator/rectifier, but that I did from the Radio Shack rectifier hooked up exactly the same way.

I'm going to call him back when the Podtronics comes back to me and I get it back on the bike. He'll step me through some tests and maybe we can get to the bottom of this once and for all. Even though, right now, the charging system seems to be doing it's job.

Bob is a nice man, he was very helpful, and he knows charging systems!
1965 CB77 305 Super Hawk
1989 NT650 Hawk GT
1981 Yamaha XJ550 Seca

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G-Man
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Post by G-Man » Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:05 pm

Hi Sara

Did Bob tell you how he tests his units and what the results were?

True about the similarity to Lucas alternators. I was wondering whether it might be possible to fit one of the latest units intended for Triumphs etc.

My Matchelss has a Lucas 6v system and people I follow ask how I did the 12v conversion because the Headlamp is so good!

G
'60 C77 '60 C72 '62 C72 Dream '63 CL72
'61 CB72 '64 CB77 '65 CB160
'66 Matchless 350 '67 CL77
'67 S90 '77 CB400F

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sarals
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Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2012 9:19 pm
Location: Monterey Peninsula, California

Post by sarals » Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:12 pm

Hi Graham!

Bob said he put it on a variac and brought the voltage up and it "came right up". He didn't tell me the threshold voltage for the regulation, and I didn't ask, but he said it worked perfectly.
1965 CB77 305 Super Hawk
1989 NT650 Hawk GT
1981 Yamaha XJ550 Seca

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