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Oil Pump Rebuild

NBD925
honda305.com Member
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:38 am
Location: Missoula, Montana

Oil Pump Rebuild

Post by NBD925 » Sat Jan 07, 2012 4:00 pm

I thought that I would share this Oil Pump rebuild with the forum. With help I think this can be a good look into this crucial part of the 305 engine.

Let’s start:

The 305 engines can use anything they can get in the way of oil pressure. Stock pressure is low to begin with at (1 - 3 psi at the most) but only degrades over time with bad gears and housings. A careful look at the oil pump gears and housing needs to be made to ensure your new rebuild or restoration will last for miles to come. Here are a couple of photos that show what you might need to look for in your oil pump.

This first picture shows the housing and the groves that have been gouged into the metal by foreign material that got sucked into the pump. Look at the top gear cavity in this picture especially. You can see the groves there. These groves degrade the pressure of your pump and this in turn starves your engine of oil in some of the most critical areas.

Image
DSCN0059 by adam.corts, on Flickr

This next picture shows a set of gears out of this same pump. Look towards the tips of the gears or the end of the teeth. See the groves in the end here. This also degrades the pressure of your oil pump. The oil is allowed to escape through these gouges and decrease oil pressure to the engine.

Image
DSCN0063 by adam.corts, on Flickr

Unfortunately I believe these parts are trashed. Could they work . . . yes but I decided to get new or better gears and a new housing. Didn't want to take any chances. Comments welcome. Maybe there is a way to save these parts?

Let’s look at possibly improving the pressure of this oil pump. The gears sit in the housing and are covered by a thin paper gasket and then the cover. If you could get the cover closer to the gears this would increase the pressure of the pump. One thing I think you can do is to take the same amount of material off the housing as the thickness of the paper gasket. This is a very small amount and should be approached with caution. Too much and you’re in big trouble, the gears will drag on the cover. What I did was measure the housing in a few spots, then measured the thickness of the paper gasket. This paper gasket measurement is the absolute maximum you should take off the housing. Be careful, I set up a piece of glass and a piece of 400 grit sand paper (to keep the surface flat) and started lightly rubbing the housing surface until I took the right amount off.

Image
DSCN0056 by adam.corts, on Flickr

After the right amount of metal was removed from the surface I cleaned both the housing and the cover. Make sure there is no residual paper gasket material left on the surfaces. The housing should be good to go after the light sanding but the cover could use a touch of sanding too. Very little here just enough to clean the paper off. Use other methods to get the old paper off if you like. Then, once clean I started the assembly.

Image
DSCN0064 by adam.corts, on Flickr

This picture should show how the parts go together the only thing not shown I believe is the second washer (Not shown or listed in the parts diagram) which goes on the main drive gear shaft (the gear that is driven by the crank gear) before it goes through the housing. I have two pumps that came with these two washers, so if I'm wrong here let me know. I was surprised to not see them in the parts diagram. Only one was shown and listed. I lightly oiled the gears and the shafts as they went together. I was careful to keep the mating surfaces clean and free of oil so the paper gasket could do its job.

Once together the rest should be easy. I installed the pan head screws and tested the gear movement in the correct direction of movement. Seems to work great.

Image
DSCN0069 by adam.corts, on Flickr

Please add comments and concerns. It is my hope that by the end of the post with your help we can have a complete rebuild tutorial of the 305 oil pump. If you don't like the upgrade to the pump please share your ideas and concerns. I hope this helps.

Mike Mullins
honda305.com Member
Posts: 247
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2007 9:24 pm
Location: Demotte IN

oil pump

Post by Mike Mullins » Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:28 pm

NBD: thanks for the post. I have wondered what should be checked on the oil pump, and now I know. Also, the tips on the thinning of the case: very helpful. Has anyone fixed the gouges in the housing ?
"a free motorcycle is a bottomless hole intended solely for money"
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NBD925
honda305.com Member
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:38 am
Location: Missoula, Montana

Post by NBD925 » Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:36 pm

I'm not sure if anyone has looked at a fix for the housing gouges. It seems to me that it would be rather tough to do. I don’t know that I would trust metal filler here. It would be tough to get it perfect and getting it to stay there is another battle. Who knows? Maybe someone on this forum knows a secret but I just elected to get a better housing and new gears.

It would be great to fix all these used pumps some how.

LOUD MOUSE
honda305.com Member
Posts: 7817
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2005 8:23 am
Location: KERRVILLE, TEXAS

Re: Oil Pump Rebuild

Post by LOUD MOUSE » Sat Jan 07, 2012 5:47 pm

The pump ya opened is total trash.
The 5 screws and gear and 2 washers and clip and gear pin are good.
Ya left out a flat washer in pic 4.
I've opened MANY of these and I'd say ya have the worst I've seen other than one which had all 5 screws loose and the gears/wheels ate themselves and the aluminum case parts.
If ya have bad cases I recommend ya get another pump rather than attempt a repair. ..........lm

NBD925 wrote:I thought that I would share this Oil Pump rebuild with the forum. With help I think this can be a good look into this crucial part of the 305 engine.

Let’s start:

The 305 engines can use anything they can get in the way of oil pressure. Stock pressure is low to begin with at (1 - 3 psi at the most) but only degrades over time with bad gears and housings. A careful look at the oil pump gears and housing needs to be made to ensure your new rebuild or restoration will last for miles to come. Here are a couple of photos that show what you might need to look for in your oil pump.

This first picture shows the housing and the groves that have been gouged into the metal by foreign material that got sucked into the pump. Look at the top gear cavity in this picture especially. You can see the groves there. These groves degrade the pressure of your pump and this in turn starves your engine of oil in some of the most critical areas.

Image
DSCN0059 by adam.corts, on Flickr

This next picture shows a set of gears out of this same pump. Look towards the tips of the gears or the end of the teeth. See the groves in the end here. This also degrades the pressure of your oil pump. The oil is allowed to escape through these gouges and decrease oil pressure to the engine.

Image
DSCN0063 by adam.corts, on Flickr

Unfortunately I believe these parts are trashed. Could they work . . . yes but I decided to get new or better gears and a new housing. Didn't want to take any chances. Comments welcome. Maybe there is a way to save these parts?

Let’s look at possibly improving the pressure of this oil pump. The gears sit in the housing and are covered by a thin paper gasket and then the cover. If you could get the cover closer to the gears this would increase the pressure of the pump. One thing I think you can do is to take the same amount of material off the housing as the thickness of the paper gasket. This is a very small amount and should be approached with caution. Too much and you’re in big trouble, the gears will drag on the cover. What I did was measure the housing in a few spots, then measured the thickness of the paper gasket. This paper gasket measurement is the absolute maximum you should take off the housing. Be careful, I set up a piece of glass and a piece of 400 grit sand paper (to keep the surface flat) and started lightly rubbing the housing surface until I took the right amount off.

Image
DSCN0056 by adam.corts, on Flickr

After the right amount of metal was removed from the surface I cleaned both the housing and the cover. Make sure there is no residual paper gasket material left on the surfaces. The housing should be good to go after the light sanding but the cover could use a touch of sanding too. Very little here just enough to clean the paper off. Use other methods to get the old paper off if you like. Then, once clean I started the assembly.

Image
DSCN0064 by adam.corts, on Flickr

This picture should show how the parts go together the only thing not shown I believe is the second washer (Not shown or listed in the parts diagram) which goes on the main drive gear shaft (the gear that is driven by the crank gear) before it goes through the housing. I have two pumps that came with these two washers, so if I'm wrong here let me know. I was surprised to not see them in the parts diagram. Only one was shown and listed. I lightly oiled the gears and the shafts as they went together. I was careful to keep the mating surfaces clean and free of oil so the paper gasket could do its job.

Once together the rest should be easy. I installed the pan head screws and tested the gear movement in the correct direction of movement. Seems to work great.

Image
DSCN0069 by adam.corts, on Flickr

Please add comments and concerns. It is my hope that by the end of the post with your help we can have a complete rebuild tutorial of the 305 oil pump. If you don't like the upgrade to the pump please share your ideas and concerns. I hope this helps.

Hoosier Tom
honda305.com Member
Posts: 817
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 10:34 pm
Location: Logansport, IN

Oil Pump Rebuild

Post by Hoosier Tom » Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:12 pm

Hats off to you for sharing your pump rebuild. For reference is a NOS oil pump body. As noted the drive gear does take 2 thrust washers, one on each side of the exterior housing.
FWIW, Honda engineered a reliable motor, provided proper maintenance was done. Even abused these engines took a licking and kept on ticking. With that said, I wouldn't recommend shaving off some of the housing thickness. Honda designed the pump to be used with the paper gasket as is. I think you are wise to disassemble, inspect and rebuild the pump replacing worn or out of spec parts.


HT
Attachments
pump 002.JPG
pump 001.JPG

NBD925
honda305.com Member
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:38 am
Location: Missoula, Montana

Post by NBD925 » Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:39 pm

Hi Loud Mouse: I know the Housing is bad as well as the gears. I just posted the pictures so others would know what to look for. What are your thoughts on removing metal from the housing to increase pressure? I got this idea from Tom here in Missoula.

So it seems my thoughts and guesses are confirmed the parts diagram shows only one washer and both my pumps had two so just a heads up to others check the post as to where they go.

Thanks Hoosier for the NOS pictures this will give people a great comparison to look at.

I'll edit all this information into the original post as it comes in. Keep the information flowing.

NBD925
honda305.com Member
Posts: 72
Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:38 am
Location: Missoula, Montana

Post by NBD925 » Sat Jan 07, 2012 8:58 pm

One more thing that I am seeing and realizing is that the lower gear shaft (the fat one in the center of the oil pump) has a flat spot on it. This flat spot needs to be aligned or pointed towards the small kidney shaped pocket with the oil path that sits in the left center area where the gears meet. This kidney shaped pocket should have a small cannel flowing to the lower gear shaft. I believe this allows oil to enter the shaft for the lower pump gear. (Refer to the NOS Oil Pump Picture Above)

Remember this when you press that shaft back into its hole.

Interesting note: On one of my pumps I do not have this small cannel. I have the Kidney shaped pocket but no cannel to the shaft. The other pump has both. Interesting as one pump is from a 62 Dream and the other form a 63. A possible change in design? I’m not sure.

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