The pic of the rod end that I posted is definitely NOT how it should look. That is a temporary rod that I 'made' from a length of 8mm stainless. The Honda rod is hardened steel and the lifter-thread (r/h) end should be absolutely squared; a used rod will have a small indentation from the ball-bearing that resides inside the lifter thread (item 34, p76 in Bill's red ERG manual).WrenchRust wrote:...... So, I just pulled the transmission aparts. Not excactly sure what I was looking for, I did a search and found a post between e3steve and wilf that had pictures (I love pictures) of the rod.
Well, I found something I think might be the clutch lifter rod but it looks differant then the one I saw in the post. (No bearing but defenently a place for one)........
Joel
Noob, just getting started on a 67 CL77
The pic of the rod end that I posted is definitely NOT how it should look. That is a temporary rod that I 'made' from a length of 8mm stainless. The Honda rod is hardened steel and the lifter-thread (r/h) end should be absolutely squared; a used rod will have a small indentation from the ball-bearing (item 34, p76 in Bill's red ERG manual) that resides inside the lifter thread.
It's good to know that it's not suppose to look like that, although it's not square at the end either, mine is very round and shiny at the end. (Bill's Engine book pg 67 item #3, Clutch lifter rod)
*** BTW, in Bill's book page 67 item #29 is Bolt, hex 6x12 and in my parts catalog item #29 is Ball, Steel 5/16 and item #30 is Bolt, hex 6x12, Bill's book having no item #30 *** Also, I noticed your referance to page 76 item #34 is for the CB series bike and that the CL and CA model bikes are shown on page 74, but once again without the ball. I'm really not out to look for mistakes. That's not my point at all. I just have very little understanding of how a Transmission & Clutch work in real life. Other then to say that different gears transfer power at different levels and the a clutch disengages the motor from the wheel (before the transmission) So in studying, I come across things that don't look like what I have in my motor and/or have seen in my other book. That being said, I'm going to get up and look at the Threaded Clutch Lifter (which happens to be item #4 on both page 74 and 76 of Bill's engine book) and see if the end of that is square.
Clink....... the penny's just dropped! OK, Joel, the reference listing for each illustration is on the BACK of that page -- i.e. p77 refers to p76 -- not on the FACING page. I know...... confusing!
Regarding the rod: the clutch (l/h) end is hemispherical; the lifter thread (r/h) end is flat (squared off). I put this illustration together a couple of years ago; it puts things a little more in perspective:
That's a great diagram, Steve. Honda should have done it that way.
WR, so you understand what is going on with this mechanism, the clutch lever on the handlebar pulls on the cable, which in turn pulls on the arm which is attached to the clutch lifter. This causes the lifter to rotate. Since the lifter and adjuster fit together with what is a very coarse thread, as the lifter turns it also "unscrews" from the adjuster which makes it move out of the adjuster. The rod's square end is inside a socket in the end of the lifter. Between the square end of the rod and the back of that socket is a single steel ball. The pupose of the ball is it allows the rod to spin while the adjuster stay's still. The hemispherical end of the rod goes into a mating hemispherical socket in the end of the lifter joint. The lifter joint presses on the clutch pressure plate. When the adjuster pushes the rod, it pushes the lifter joint which in turn pushes the clutch pressure plate and compresses the springs in the clutch which allows the clutch plates (drive and driven) to slip relative to each other (disengage) So, the rod spins because the clutch is spinning. If the engine is not running it really does not matter what condition the rod or ball are in. The ball could even be missing for that matter and it would have no effect on clutch effort. I'd have to see which direction the clutch spins relative to the lifter to determine if a running engine would put some force on the release mechanism if the end of the rod were chewed up or if the bearing was missing. But if you have a clutch that requires a lot of effort to disengage, then either the lifter is not greased or otherwise free to rotate in the adjustor, the cable is rusty or crusty inside, or you have extra heavy springs in the clutch. I have a tranny completely apart and just finished cleaning the parts yesterday. They are all laid out on a table right now. If you want pictures of the correct parts to show how they should look, let me know and when the wife gets back with the van (camera is in the van) I'll snap some macro photos of the various bits you are interested in. regards, Rob
Thanks Rob; it just made sense to orientate the illustrations into a logical diagram -- like orientating a map. I overdrew the wiring diagrams in colour for the same reason -- to make things easier to follow. The clutch lifter components must go together and make the correct length, end-to-end, or the lifter thread lever arm will be pulling from the wrong angle and scribing a poor arc, thus requiring more effort at the handlebar lever. The lifter lever arm probably has only a usable efficiency through about 90º. The same applies to the shifter pedal and lever; which is why the shifter lever needs to point to 11 o'clock.
Steve, great diagram. Really helpful. It's easier to see how this things going to go back together.
Rob, I'm going read through that post a few more times while looking at the diagrams in the books. And yes, I would love some pictures. I'm about to upload some myself, most so you guys can tell me what parts are worn and need to be replaced. Thanks so much guys, I think this is the scariest part of the rebuild 'cause I've got no idea at all what I'm looking at or what anything in here does. Joel
| |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
