30W Non-detergent - Or is there something better?

[LOUD MOUSE]

Well have another!
You along with s many others on this forum seen to want to Be The One Who Gets All The Others to agree with you AND DO AS YOU DO
Do you really think you needed to go to all the trouble you did?
Didn't you see as you did your research how any times others have Been Down That Path?
For what it's worth after so many times of the SOS I wouldn't run YOUR PERFECT OIL if you gave it to me and paid me if I did.
What's it to you what I run?
Also when asked what I do/did I answer the question and if others want to do as I do or don't I personally don't care.
Last I checked I've NEVER SAID YOU HAD TO USE ND!
Praise Be To The OIL GODS!. ..............lm

Back up why!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK here ya go.
I was there in the early 60's when these type engines were issued by HONDA.
At this time I've rebuilt more of these engines than you will likely ever see. (7 in the last 6 weeks.)
At that time the multi weight and DET oils were not available at first but just coming out.
Things like hydrolic lifters in the new V8 engines needed it as they would clatter as you started a cold engine.
No clatter with solid lifters with ND oil.
No HONDA didn't offer their brand of either oil at that time and you found only one mention of the ND.
A that time you could buy paraffin or some other other type of oil but no MG Det.
Time came when the MG DET oil was available more and more and as had to happen HONDA offered their logo on the cans.
This didn't happen overnight but as time went on HONDA recommended MG DET so they made the $$$$ and from that time on any mention of oil type was MG DET.
Ever wonder what oil is recommended for AC/fan motors?
What to put on door hinges?
I even have the nerve to use 30W Non Det. in the forks of my Super Hawks and Scramblers.
There is your answer and you can do as you like and don't ever think I didn't/don't have my reasons for what I do/have done or expect you or anyone else to follow what I do today.
Others like you will come along and attempt to be That Person Who Became LORD OF OIL!. ............lm

OK! I must admit I put junk/crap oil in my engines and every time I ride them I apologize to the OIL GODS that I DO WHAT I DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
RUN ON HONDA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. ......lm

Ed, the topic of this thread has had many opinions and brought out some things way over my head but thinking some of them over I can see some points. I normally never post to an oil thread mainly because it gets the "flaming" like your comment above, everyone has their opinion! I've backed what I've posted with Honda's own words, and dates. I for one haven't seen you back up the "why" to use nondetergent oil and would be interested in hearing this for the sake of discussion in a civilized non-flaming tone. Anything I've stated above please show me where I'm wrong. I have too much respect for you by your experience with these machines to let emotion get the best of me, respect is earned. I'm sure the oil gods are satisfied with what you use over "some" of the modern oils which can harm these engines.

[sixtiescycle]

Well have another!
You along with s many others on this forum seen to want to Be The One Who Gets All The Others to agree with you AND DO AS YOU DO
Do you really think you needed to go to all the trouble you did?

For what it's worth after so many times of the SOS I wouldn't run YOUR PERFECT OIL if you gave it to me and paid me if I did.
What's it to you what I run?
Also when asked what I do/did I answer the question and if others want to do as I do or don't I personally don't care.
Last I checked I've NEVER SAID YOU HAD TO USE ND!
Praise Be To The OIL GODS!. ..............lm

Back up why!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK here ya go.
I was there in the early 60's when these type engines were issued by HONDA.
At this time I've rebuilt more of these engines than you will likely ever see. (7 in the last 6 weeks.)
At that time the multi weight and DET oils were not available at first but just coming out.
Things like hydrolic lifters in the new V8 engines needed it as they would clatter as you started a cold engine.
No clatter with solid lifters with ND oil.
No HONDA didn't offer their brand of either oil at that time and you found only one mention of the ND.
A that time you could buy paraffin or some other other type of oil but no MG Det.
Time came when the MG DET oil was available more and more and as had to happen HONDA offered their logo on the cans.
This didn't happen overnight but as time went on HONDA recommended MG DET so they made the $$$$ and from that time on any mention of oil type was MG DET.
Ever wonder what oil is recommended for AC/fan motors?
What to put on door hinges?
I even have the nerve to use 30W Non Det. in the forks of my Super Hawks and Scramblers.
There is your answer and you can do as you like and don't ever think I didn't/don't have my reasons for what I do/have done or expect you or anyone else to follow what I do today.
Others like you will come along and attempt to be That Person Who Became LORD OF OIL!. ............lm

"At this time I've rebuilt more of these engines than you will likely ever see. (7 in the last 6 weeks.)"

I can't argue that point!

To answer some of your questions:
(1) "Do you really think you needed to go to all the trouble you did?"

Yes I did. (see question #2)

(2)"Didn't you see as you did your research how any times others have Been Down That Path?"

Yes I did but never saw any reference to Honda's recommendation changing to a detergent oil which I thought was relevant.

(3)"Things like hydrolic lifters in the new V8 engines needed it as they would clatter as you started a cold engine. No clatter with solid lifters with ND oil."

No more clatter on my small block Chevy when I ran detergent oil and the 375 fueler solid lifter cam than my 272 Y-block Ford w/ND oil that I can recall as long as the clearances were adjusted to spec. What's your point?

(4)"Ever wonder what oil is recommended for AC/fan motors? What to put on door hinges?"

No, relevance to the topic?

"I even have the nerve to use 30W Non Det. in the forks of my Super Hawks and Scramblers."

I have no problem with this.

"There is your answer and you can do as you like and don't ever think I didn't/don't have my reasons for what I do/have done or expect you or anyone else to follow what I do today."

Thank you for answer!

"Time came when the MG DET oil was available more and more and as had to happen HONDA offered their logo on the cans. This didn't happen overnight but as time went on HONDA recommended MG DET so they made the $$$$ and from that time on any mention of oil type was MG DET."

I don't quite get this, are you saying Honda was being paid by the oil companies for endorsing their oils over their research on what's best for their product?

"Others like you will come along and attempt to be That Person Who Became LORD OF OIL!. ............lm"

Never said I wanted to be, just stated some facts I thought were relevant to the discussion and wondered why you recommend ND oil. I never recommended any oil, Honda did.

[LOUD MOUSE]

Well have another!
You along with s many others on this forum seen to want to Be The One Who Gets All The Others to agree with you AND DO AS YOU DO
Do you really think you needed to go to all the trouble you did?

For what it's worth after so many times of the SOS I wouldn't run YOUR PERFECT OIL if you gave it to me and paid me if I did.
What's it to you what I run?
Also when asked what I do/did I answer the question and if others want to do as I do or don't I personally don't care.
Last I checked I've NEVER SAID YOU HAD TO USE ND!
Praise Be To The OIL GODS!. ..............lm

Back up why!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK here ya go.
I was there in the early 60's when these type engines were issued by HONDA.
At this time I've rebuilt more of these engines than you will likely ever see. (7 in the last 6 weeks.)
At that time the multi weight and DET oils were not available at first but just coming out.
Things like hydrolic lifters in the new V8 engines needed it as they would clatter as you started a cold engine.
No clatter with solid lifters with ND oil.
No HONDA didn't offer their brand of either oil at that time and you found only one mention of the ND.
A that time you could buy paraffin or some other other type of oil but no MG Det.
Time came when the MG DET oil was available more and more and as had to happen HONDA offered their logo on the cans.
This didn't happen overnight but as time went on HONDA recommended MG DET so they made the $$$$ and from that time on any mention of oil type was MG DET.
Ever wonder what oil is recommended for AC/fan motors?
What to put on door hinges?
I even have the nerve to use 30W Non Det. in the forks of my Super Hawks and Scramblers.
There is your answer and you can do as you like and don't ever think I didn't/don't have my reasons for what I do/have done or expect you or anyone else to follow what I do today.
Others like you will come along and attempt to be That Person Who Became LORD OF OIL!. ............lm

"At this time I've rebuilt more of these engines than you will likely ever see. (7 in the last 6 weeks.)"

I can't argue that point!

To answer some of your questions:
(1) "Do you really think you needed to go to all the trouble you did?"

Yes I did. (see question #2)

(2)"Didn't you see as you did your research how any times others have Been Down That Path?"

Yes I did but never saw any reference to Honda's recommendation changing to a detergent oil which I thought was relevant.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<it's there and has been since the middle/late 60's. Look better as others have mentioned it>>>>>>>>>>>>>

(3)"Things like hydrolic lifters in the new V8 engines needed it as they would clatter as you started a cold engine. No clatter with solid lifters with ND oil."

No more clatter on my small block Chevy when I ran detergent oil and the 375 fueler solid lifter cam than my 272 Y-block Ford w/ND oil that I can recall as long as the clearances were adjusted to spec. What's your point? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<a good reason/fact for MG DET in the time of the early HD lifters ya see there were something new back then>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

(4)"Ever wonder what oil is recommended for AC/fan motors? What to put on door hinges?"

No, relevance to the topic? <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<ND 30W is what you will find in most of the small cans and you want me to better understand oil>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

"I even have the nerve to use 30W Non Det. in the forks of my Super Hawks and Scramblers."

I have no problem with this.<<<<<<<<<<<<<doesn't matter here>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

"There is your answer and you can do as you like and don't ever think I didn't/don't have my reasons for what I do/have done or expect you or anyone else to follow what I do today."

Thank you for answer! <<<<<<<<<<<<<<more than welcome>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

"Time came when the MG DET oil was available more and more and as had to happen HONDA offered their logo on the cans. This didn't happen overnight but as time went on HONDA recommended MG DET so they made the $$$$ and from that time on any mention of oil type was MG DET."

I don't quite get this, are you saying Honda was being paid by the oil companies for endorsing their oils over their research on what's best for their product?<<<<<<<<<<<<the cans showed HONDA so the shop could now sell their brand off their shelves which usually causes the buyer to figure the oil is a better match for the HONDA engine than gas station oil. Keep in mind this was early in the HONDA bike years and we/some bought anything with HONDA as the brand. Better for the bike ya know!>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<you are correct here but that information is known by HONDA riders and has been for years.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<this discussion is the reason I refuse to do as Bill Silver has done since the 90's and gather data and put it down in black/white/color. Someone always comes along and gets into the Ya But just as you did. As all know I answer requests for help on this forum but usually and not always after others have a chance to reply. Many on the forum were ignorant back when and I will say that today they can be referred to as experts. What a pleasure to watch this happen over the years. Then there are the ones who come on and act like they are the answer to everything .Usually they don't stay long. I see your list of early HONDAS and will say as for them you have good taste.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

"Others like you will come along and attempt to be That Person Who Became LORD OF OIL!. ............lm"

Never said I wanted to be, just stated some facts I thought were relevant to the discussion and wondered why you recommend ND oil. I never recommended any oil, Honda did.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<if that is what you wondered any reason you didn't just ask and I'd answer without you loading the subject question with research first?.I know as that way you could play Ya Butt.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HAVE A SAFE DAY. ...........emo

[jerry]

"On Ya Loudmouse." You are my best friend , brother and Honda cohort and we dont even use the same oils. "Life is beautiful brother." All the best Jerry

[G3]

Oil threads...uhhg.
Under the heading "Inspection and Adjustment" (in the CL72 Maintenance Manual), Section E-2, Changing Engine Oil, NOTE (3), Use a non detergent oil. Never mix with an unknown brand (probably referring to the preferred Honda Ultra Oil in 1963). Simple enough for me.

[sixtiescycle]

Oil threads...uhhg.
Under the heading "Inspection and Adjustment" (in the CL72 Maintenance Manual), Section E-2, Changing Engine Oil, NOTE (3), Use a non detergent oil. Never mix with an unknown brand (probably referring to the preferred Honda Ultra Oil in 1963). Simple enough for me.

Go read my first post and you'll see I referenced this.

[jensey]

Hi,

A lot is said in this oil thread, a lot of experience is an added value too, but what I missed where test results. Since I like to measure things, I decided to start with a fresh CB450 K0 engine and take up the gauntlet. I know that a CB450 engine has it's specific issue's, but what those engines have in common is the way the crank is build up (roller bearings), air cooling and designed in (more or less) the same period

For everyone who's interested in tests results gathered from by riding laboratory:

http://www.hondatwins.net/forums/55-eng ... e-0-a.html

An update will be posted soon.

Jensen