A hello, a thank you and some questions...

[Poorfish]

Hi guys. I'll just jump right into the story, here. A friend of mine has had this bike in storage for several years and, as it has been told to me, is a 1969 Honda Dream. It's basically a bike in a box. His father bought it brand new and, down the line, passed it on to my friend who decided to take it apart himself and rebuild it to give back to his father. While my friend is a very smart man, he's not overly mechanically inclined. The project stalled and has been sitting for many years. I've been building and rebuilding pretty much any thing with an engine for many years so I decided to take it on and get it back together for him. He's going in Wednesday to have a tumor removed from his brain, and I'd like there to be some progress made on this thing when he gets out... and that quest led me here.

I've gotten a good bit of it back together, but am stumped on a few things. I've scanned you guys' forum here and it's been a lot of help while I was putting it back together so I figured I'd just get on with the questions I have left... hoping I could just condense my information.

The things I have on my mind now...

When I was putting the back wheel on, the chain seems impossibly short and the axle bolt won't line up at all since the wheel is too far forward with the chain on. This one pretty much has me stumped.

I read on here that it doesn't make much difference which plug the coil wires go to. Seems logical, but wanted to verify.

The pistons should move with the kick start, right? The motor seems frozen to me so I have PB Blaster soaking in the cylinders right now. Once it starts moving, I'll change all the fluids and what not. It's only got 5000 original miles on it and has been stored inside it's entire life so I'm hoping it will just take a little finesse to get them moving. It hasn't run, as far as he can remember, in at least 30 years or so. I feel like I'm going about this the right way but, again, just wanted to verify.

I'm a little confused on the year. He told me it was a 69, but I read on here that they didn't make a Dream in 69. The case reads CA77E - 1034517. Any insight on this would be helpful, if for nothing other than my own knowledge.

Lastly, what in the world is that huge adjustment knob where the forks meet the frame? I've never seen anything like that, and haven't found any info on that just yet.

I thank you for the info I've already gotten from here, and any info you guys can give me from here on out in advance.

[G-Man]

Poorfish

Welcome to the forum!!

Sounds like you need a longer chain. I suspect that either someone has removed a link out of the chain or fitted a larger sprocket.

This bike was discontinued in '67 but many were hanging around in showrooms for a while after that. There is a white tag on the wiring harness under the tank which is a closer approximation to the actual build date.

Patience is the best tool when freeing up the engine. Do bear in mind that the rings ma be stuck and need freeing up.

The big knob is a steering damper which is up posed to reduce speed wobbles at high speed.

G

[Poorfish]

Thanks for the response, G man!

The chain still has me confused... he insists the bike was in complete original form when he got to taking it apart and, as far as I can tell, he's right. Everything looks to be 100% original. I'll continue to let that bounce around in my mind a bit and see what I can come up with.

I found the tag on the harness you mentioned. It says 1966. Would that make this a 1966 model and he got the year wrong or, is it possible that a 1966 sat around long enough and they listed it as a 1969? Either way, I suppose, I should keep the 1966 year in mind when I'm ordering parts, correct?

I have a lot of patience when it comes to freeing up the engine. I actually spend most of my free time tinkering with old VW's... I'm no stranger to letting one soak for a month or so waiting for it to free itself up. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I suppose time will tell when it comes to this venture!

Thanks for letting me know what that knob was. It was really driving me crazy! I can see one bouncing around in my memories archive but couldn't for the life of me remember what in the world it was for! It both makes me laugh and makes me upset that the old tale came true... I've forgotten what most of the kids nowadays will ever learn! Haha!


I do have one more question... in looking at the air filter, I see there's two clear tubes running from it. The only place I can figure out that they may go is to the fittings on the heads either side of the carb. Seems odd to me, but I can't come up with anything that makes better sense. Any insight on that?

[G-Man]

Poorfish

Yes the tag in the loom is nearer the data of manufacture. It is actually when the harness was made so no more than 1 year out from the data for the bike. I think it is very possible that it hung around in a dealer for 3 years, especially at the end when they were less than fashionable. Yes bear that in mind when ordering parts, although you'll have trouble convincing any parts supplier that you have a '69 Dream... :-)

Again, you are right about the tubes. They admit air to little holes in the inlet valve guides in an attempt to reduce the vacuum there in order to reduce oil being pulled into the combustion chamber. I don't think it ever worked properly and was deleted on later models. You can safely connect the two tubes together with no ill effects.

Have fun with that bike!

G

[conbs]

Fish,

What a great project. Best wishes to your friend in his battle.

As usual, Graham has done a great job of answering your questions. As you have found, he is very knowledgeable.

That said, that "huge adjustment knob" would appear to be very important indeed. Per the Owner's Manual, it is the "Steering handle damper - Tightness of the steering handle can be chosen as your favorite, according to the condition of the road surface." Hmmm. Actually I have never been able to find my "favorite" tightness on either of my bikes. It seems like when I adjust it out to being too loose and then start to tighten it, it is too loose and then suddenly becomes too tight. Not one of Mr. Honda's best efforts.

The issue of it being a '69 built in '66 or '67 is not that big of a deal. These bikes were built before VIN numbers became standardized in the US. Don't think in terms of a "model year" or you'll never make sense of it. When you are ordering parts for your bike, you only need your frame (no VIN) or engine number. With the exception of the change from CA77 to CA78 in mid 1963, Honda made a number of running changes one part at a time throughout production. If you look at your parts manual, the changes are noted by frame/engine number and not by year of production.

To break your engine free, you might try putting it in 4th gear and with clutch engaged, gently rock it back and forth. Some guys report having luck with that, but often need to let the PB Blaster (you might try 50% ATF, 50% Acetone) soak for days or weeks. If that doesn't work, you will have to do more to get rid of the rust.

I have not tried it yet, but I wonder if EvapoRust or a similar product would work. Drain the oil and leave the plug out so you can tell how much is leaking past the rings. I think you would have to prop up the front of the bike to level the top of the piston, too. You would also want to flush it out completely as it get pretty sticky and don't let it dry out. These are a couple of thoughts to try before a tear down and rebuild.

If original, your drive chain would be a 525 pitch of 96 links. If that's what you have, then count the teeth on the sprockets 16 and 29 were original.

I hope that helps you. Thank you for taking on this project. The world would be a better place if more people did the kind of thing you are doing.

[Poorfish]

Many thanks to the both of you!

My friend is out of surgery and is in his own room healing. His surgery went better than expected. The tumor has been completely removed and things are looking good. They're saying he may actually be able to come home tomorrow or Saturday. We're all expecting the best.

Interesting to find out that G-Man's name is Graham. I have been a member on an old Datsun Z car site for about 15 years now and one of our most knowledgeable members is also named Graham. Pretty cool as I've never actually met a Graham in person!

I'll definitely keep the numbers in mind. As of now, all I'm looking at is the typical stuff that, I'm assuming, would not be model year specific. Battery, tires, carb rebuild, petcock rebuild, plugs, etc. Providing I can get the motor to turn, of course. I'm still keeping my hopes up that it will break free since it's been kept inside it's whole life but I suppose you never really know. We all know good and well the simplest task tends to become a real pain more often than not! I've had it soaking since I got it... Once I figure out why the chain seems so short and I can get the rear wheel engaged, Ill try the fourth gear trick. I'll also count the links and the teeth on the sprockets to see if that's an issue. That info is greatly appreciated.

I haven't laid my fingers on that adjustment knob since I wasn't sure what it was. Now that I know what it is, it still seems odd to me and, since the front end has remained completely untouched even after my friend started taking it apart, probably best I leave it that way. I'll get it running and looking nice... he can adjust it to his liking.

All the info and kind words are very much appreciated, guys! I'll definitely keep you informed of how this project turns out. I mocked up the gas tank and the seat today just to get an idea in my mind of a finished product and I think it's going to be great. When I was a kid, I had a Honda Hobbit that I putted around the neighborhood. This Dream kind of reminds me of what a Hobbit would be when it was all grown up... I'm really looking forward to getting it up and running!

[G-Man]

Poorfish

HaHa! Americans always have problem with my first name! When I come over on business I often get called Curtis Graham or even Edward Graham. It's a reasonably popular name in the UK.

Conbs has an encyclopaedic knowledge of all of the changes to these bike so it is always good to get him involved in a discussion. He always comes up with interesting observations from what, to me, are just list of numbers.

Good to hear that your friend is through surgery. He will be pleased to know about your progress with the bike, I am sure.

If you get a chance, post some pictures. It is good for us to see what you are seeing. Someone will spot something that will help you.

Take care and don't rush anything. You have an interesting project.

G